[opencms-dev] OpenCms Not at all User Friendly

Thu Apr 3 18:27:21 CEST 2008

Hi Isaac
Thanks for your reply.I admit that my suggestion may not fit for all users.I
myself have not seen all the features of opencms.But yes as a newbie i felt
difficultly .I would  go through your suggestions and would try  to work
out.

Thanks
Raj

On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 9:12 PM, Isaac R. Higgins <isaac.higgins at isaacray.com>
wrote:

>
> This letter seems some-what inflammatory, but I can offer some assistance.
>
> Most of your questions can be answered by reading through the examples and
> tutorials in a clean install of OpenCMS.  I suggest you setup a machine as a
> test server and database so that you can bang around and familiarize
> yourself with OpenCMS.
>
> Most other information can be found here:
> http://opencms-wiki.org/Main_Page
> and in the list serve archives.
>
> We generally do not like to answer questions that have been answered
> several times before or that have been answered in the documentation.  The
> clean-install TemplateOne examples will prove most useful when trying to
> learn to be an OpenCMS site administrator.
>
> As far as being a content author, there is almost nothing more simple than
> creating and updating content.  Familiarize yourself with the "Explorer"
> which works much to the same structure as windows explorer where resources
> exist as folders and documents of various types.  Right click on a resource
> in the right pane of your explorer to access various options, including
> edit, permissions, and properties.  Permissions work just like they do in
> windows, there shouldn't be much confusion here.  Windows has a group called
> "Administrators" as well as an account called "Administrator"  There is a
> hierarchal structure for permissions inheritance just like in windows. Look
> at your "My Documents" folder in windows as an example.  It is locked from
> viewing by other users in the system, but if a user is in the administrators
> group, they can see it.  Additionally, as an OpenCMS(6.2.3) admin, you have
> the freedom to use groups only to assign permissions (this works great when
> there are many users in a group who need the same rights) or you can assign
> specific user permissions to a specific resource and opt to override
> inherited permissions.
>
> You request "role based" permissions to be implemented... check out the
> features page for OpenCMS 7:
> http://www.opencms.org/en/support/features/features7/usermanagement.html
>
> Lastly, I suggest you read the documentation for both versions.  If you
> can't figure out how to install the modules, you can find versions of it
> using google.
> OpenCMS 7 Documentation Modules:
> http://www.opencms.org/en/download/documentation.html
> OpenCMS 6 Documentation Module Archives:
> http://www.opencms.org/en/download/archive.html
>
> A quick google search lead me to this:
> http://cms.ngsltd.com/opencms6/opencms/
> Use the links at the top to browse the opencms 6 clean install documents.
> Here's one for OpenCMS 7:
> http://www.bng-galiza.org/opencms/opencms/
>
>
> To answer more specifically:
> 1. I would start with folder structure in the current project.  Explore
> making changes to templateone, and creating a microsite to help gain
> familiarity.
>
> 2. Your idea seems logical for your purposes, but not for the majority of
> OpenCMS users.  For example, I have one project and 1000s of users.  I like
> being able to manage groups separately from users and projects. One the
> other hand, if you had a small handful of users, and a lot of projects, it
> could be infinitely cumbersome to have to administer new groups and users
> for every project created.  Take advantage of inherited permissions, you can
> assign a group to a folder and all it's subfolders. Additionally, I don't
> know of any Microsoft products that add user/group creation into the project
> setup wizard.  Not even Active Directory (which is the base of all MS
> networked users/groups).  They all give you a default group to be
> administered later.
>
> 3. In the administrators view of explorer, create your users/groups.  In
> explorer view, right click on the resource you wish to permit, and assign
> permissions.  I can't imagine a simpler way.  You can assign users and/or
> groups in the same manner.  Group assignments work for me because I could
> have 100 users in a group and assign them all the rights to a resource at
> the same time.  Then, I can pick one user out of the group and assign them
> publish rights (which will override their group rights).  You can learn more
> about permissions if you create a separate account for yourself and
> experiment with what different settings do to your practice account.
>
> 4.a.b. Admin always has full permissions from my experience
>
> 4.b. You can test this and see what the results are, there is a hierarchy
> of permissions when applied to a resource and you can specifically override
> inherited.
>
> 4.c. If one of the user's groups grant permission, permission is granted.
>  The formula for Group1, Group2, Group3 is:
> deny permission if (Group1 or Group2 or Group3) has denied permission,
> else, allow permission.
> So, if one group has denied view access, then the other groups can not
> allow view access, unless it's the Admin group.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: opencms-dev-bounces at opencms.org on behalf of Raj Malhotra
> Sent: Thu 4/3/2008 9:15 AM
> To: The OpenCms mailing list
> Subject: Re: [opencms-dev] OpenCms Not at all User Friendly
>
> Hi Georgi
> It may sound silly to you as you may be one of the experts in OpenCms.But
> i
> have just started working in OPenCms .I am working on a OpenCms
> application
> which uses 6.2.3 version I have to migrate it to 7.0.4 version.
> I will say that there is no true sequence to create a project.I will post
> few questions which came to my mind
> 1.I want to create a website so should i start with creating project in
> opencms or first should create folder structure.?
>
> 2.what to create first group or users. what i am doing after trying random
> way is that first i am creating folder structure then i will create group
> then user  assign user to group and finally will create project .This is
> my
> suggestion that everything should be in wizard manner once you click on
> create project ,you should be provided with options one by one and at the
> end your project should be complete.ex like microsoft products.
>
> 3.I am totally confused with the users.groups and roles .How we are
> assinging permission is not at all clear .Present way is not friendly
> .when
> you create user you just assign group but i just cannot see where how
> permmissions are assign or  how permission system is going to work.
>
> 4. once you create everything and righclick on the resource say  a jsp.
> And
> you select permissions .you see userr permmissions,permssion inherited
> from
> parent folders and resource permission.The following doubts are in mind
> regarding this.
>
>  a.user permission means if  i  login as Admin then   'user permission' on
> resource means that admin has these permission on the jsp.
>
>
>  b.looking at 'permissions inherited from parent folder' there  you have
> Adminstrators ,Users,ProjectManagers group.I think that if login user is
> Administrator then his available permsions are shown in Administrators
> groups,If login user belongs to 'ProjectManagers' group then
> ProjectManager
> group is showing his permission.
>
> but then b is contradicting a.
>
> c.finally resouce permission also there .so if all these is shown in the
> UI
> what is the actual permissions fo login users how its determined if user
> belongs to two groups.
>
> I read something about 'Role based Acess Control' and heard lots of praise
> for such system.I am not sure but if it makes OpenCms simpler then it
> should
> be implemented.
>
> I have looked this much only in OpenCms and i found permssion assingment
> very complex.I have already posted many posts in last few days but didnt
> get
> single answer.
>
>
> regards
> Raj
>
> On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 6:51 PM, Georgi Naplatanov <gosho at oles.biz> wrote:
>
> > Hello, Raj
> >
> > can You explain, or give some examples for non user friendly behaviour
> > of opencms ?
> >
> > Raj Malhotra wrote:
> > > Hi
> > > I am beginner in opencms.I think it is not at all user friendly
> > application
> > > . If you take example of  windows and linux .its more complex like
> > linux.A
> > > new person cant understand it easily.I wish it should be as easy as
> > > windows.May be opencms community should work on making it more user
> > > friendly.
> > > thanks
> > > Raj
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
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>
>
>
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