[opencms-dev] External editing

M Butcher mbutcher at grcomputing.net
Wed Jul 7 22:05:01 CEST 2004 

Alex, et all --

Ahmed pointed out that WebDAV does have locking (#3 below). I'm reading 
the spec right now, and it looks like "exclusive locking" would match up 
with what OpenCms does already.

Other than that, I agree 100% with Alex's proposal below. I hadn't 
thought of using a project, but I think that is an excellent idea.

So, would this sort of thing belong in the core OpenCms product, or in a 
module?

Matt

Alexander Kandzior wrote:
> I have also thought about a potential WebDAV integration. 
> 
> Well my current concept for the WebDAV integration would look like this:
> 
> 1. WebDAV access to the OpenCms VFS is possible only for the "offline"
> version (of course).
> 2. A special offline project e.g. called "WebDAV" should be created. All
> file changes with webdav are made in this project.
> 3. Locking/Unlocking of a file could be tricky. We could always still use
> the Workplace to lock a file in the Webdav project before working with it.
> Another otion is some sort of "auto lock" mechanism that locks the file if a
> change is made (ie. file is saved with webdav) and the file is currently
> unlocked. 
> 4. Permissions would be fairly simple, the file must not even appear in
> WebDav if the user has no read permissions, and if he has no write
> permissions but tries to write an error occurs. 
> 
> What do you think?
> 
> Best Regards,
> Alex.
> 
> Alexander Kandzior
> Alkacon Software - The OpenCms Experts
> http://www.alkacon.com
> 
> 
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: opencms-dev-admin at opencms.org 
>>[mailto:opencms-dev-admin at opencms.org] On Behalf Of M Butcher
>>Sent: Wednesday, July 07, 2004 7:47 PM
>>To: opencms-dev at opencms.org
>>Subject: Re: [opencms-dev] External editing
>>
>>
>>Tom,
>>
>>I see what you are getting at. That is sorta what I had considered 
>>originally (except I was thinking it would require a special editor).
>>
>>The reason that I suggested that we'd need a local repository is that 
>>Web documents in general tend to have a high reliance on 
>>other documents 
>>on the same server. How would we deal with image galleries, 
>>stylesheets, 
>>etc?
>>
>>I'm still considering the SOAP v. WebDAV question (understanding that 
>>there are other options)... the main thing is that some 
>>mechanism needs 
>>to check permissions, do the file locking, etc. before the 
>>client gets 
>>to edit the file -- and we need some way to manage locking from the 
>>client side. I think this is beyond WebDAV's current 
>>abilities. Anyone 
>>developed WebDAV extensions? Are they easy to do?
>>
>>Matt
>>
>>Tom Howe wrote:
>>
>>>There isn't specifically a need for a local CMS repository, 
>>
>>although 
>>
>>>for some things it would certainly help (ie where several documents 
>>>are required in combination to perform an editing task 
>>
>>(DTD/XSLT/XML).
>>
>>>But generally, the idea is that the user downloads the 
>>
>>document to be 
>>
>>>edited, a lightweight desktop application catches the 
>>
>>download, opens 
>>
>>>the file in the local editing application and posts it back 
>>
>>once the 
>>
>>>file has changed.
>>>
>>>This process is simply an alternative to the one occuring 
>>
>>already when 
>>
>>>the browser based editor presents a file for editing and then saves 
>>>it. Nothing more than that.
>>>
>>>The situation where more than one file is required to perform an 
>>>editing task is a little harder to manage I guess. I suppose there 
>>>would need to be a way of downloading a package of files or project 
>>>and then having them all monitored for changes.
>>>
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: opencms-dev-admin at opencms.org 
>>>[mailto:opencms-dev-admin at opencms.org] On Behalf Of M Butcher
>>>Sent: 02 July 2004 18:25
>>>To: opencms-dev at opencms.org
>>>Subject: Re: [opencms-dev] External editing
>>>
>>>
>>>Oh, I see... the client part would function more like the 
>>
>>TortoiseSVN
>>
>>>client (Windows client for Subversion) -- it's main job would be to 
>>>synchronize between a remote and a local CMS repository.
>>>
>>>That would introduce a fairly complex set of requirements... 
>>>primarily,
>>>the CMS would have to handle things more like a version 
>>
>>control system. 
>>
>>>I wouldn't see that as impossible, but definitely difficult. 
>>>Essentially, it would pose the same problem that the current 
>>>synchronize-to-disk function is having. Hmm... that's a lot 
>>
>>to think 
>>
>>>about. ;-)
>>>
>>>Matt
>>>
>>>Tom Howe wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I wouldn't waste time writing a client editor! The bitflux one,
>>>
>>>although
>>>
>>>
>>>>clever is pretty awful compared with anything available on the
>>>
>>>desktop.
>>>
>>>
>>>>Some of the browser based ones like eWebEditPro are ok, but 
>>
>>still not
>>
>>>as
>>>
>>>
>>>>good as a decent desktop one. I used to use Teamsite at a previous
>>>>workplace and the fact that you could use familiar desktop
>>>
>>>applications to
>>>
>>>
>>>>edit the content made the most sense. Dreamweaver for html, notepad
>>>
>>>for
>>>
>>>
>>>>text, photoshop for images etc. Now we have decent authoring tools
>>>
>>>like
>>>
>>>
>>>>XMLSPY available for XML editing it would make sense to use them for
>>>>content management too. The Zope plugin I mention does the job of 
>>>>triggering the relevent application and sending the contents back to
>>>
>>>the
>>>
>>>
>>>>CMS engine. All that needs to be done is catch the posting of that
>>>>content, save it to the right place and unlock the file. That way,
>>>
>>>content
>>>
>>>
>>>>management developers can stop wasting time developing editing tools
>>>
>>>and
>>>
>>>
>>>>get on with building better interfaces for managing workflow and
>>>>deployment. 
>>>>
>>>>On Fri, 2 Jul 2004, M Butcher wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Tom,
>>>>>
>>>>>I evaluated creating a module to do this using the SOAP 
>>
>>XML protocol.
>>
>>>It
>>>
>>>
>>>>>can be done... it's just a lot of work (mainly in implementing the
>>>>>client). I didn't want to do it myself.
>>>>>
>>>>>In the simplest case, SOAP functions would have to exist 
>>
>>for checking
>>
>>>>>permissions, (un)locking, getting the resource, and 
>>
>>posting the edited
>>
>>>
>>>>>resource. Really, that's not too bad.
>>>>>
>>>>>I also looked at creating a XUL application 
>>
>>(Mozilla-specific client
>>
>>>>>application) which would use Mozilla's composer to do the 
>>
>>editing. It 
>>
>>>>>would use the SOAP interface to communicate to the server. 
>>
>>This part 
>>
>>>>>would have been pretty difficult, though. Maybe a Python or Java
>>>
>>>client
>>>
>>>
>>>>>would be easier.
>>>>>
>>>>>If enough people are interested, maybe we should try to target a
>>>
>>>module
>>>
>>>
>>>>>for 6.0. I'm fairly familiar with the OpenCms internals, 
>>
>>and would be
>>
>>>>>excited to work on the communication layer, but implementing the
>>>
>>>client
>>>
>>>
>>>>>editor interface sends chills up my spine. ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>>Matt
>>>>>
>>>>>Tom Howe wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>As a follow up to a post I made regarding external editing, I
>>>
>>>discovered
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>that Zope have an external editor application that does 
>>
>>just this. 
>>
>>>>>>It
>>>
>>>uses
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>a faily standard HTTP post to send the changed data back 
>>
>>and webdav
>>
>>>for
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>file locking. Might be worth implementing as part of opencms..
>>>>>>
>>>>>>URL is
>>>>>>http://www.zope.org/Members/Caseman/ExternalEditor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tom
>>>>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
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> 
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